Carl Tyler's Blog

1 - Hmmm....I definitely need to learn more. We use Sametime a LOT for eMeetings. Application and screen sharing is the absolute #1 function that we use above all others when using Sametime for eMeetings.

2 - Our Admin guys have just set up Workplace 1.1 to allow the evaluation of the learning component. So far it just seems big and fragile, I'll post more after a few days of use.

I have the feeling that your last sentence is on the money. I have has the same conversation a number of times in the last 24 hours - based on your post.

3 - I don't think ANYBODY has ever positioned Workplace 1.1 as a replacement for Sametime.
In the future, is there convergence planned? Yes, absolutely. But I don't understand why you keep insisting on comparing the first go of J2EE to the mature Domino-based offerings. Nobody intended them to be equal out of the gate.

4 - sorry, I'm cheesed off now, so I actually just went and read Carl Kriger's presentation on the IM/web conferencing/team spaces road map, and it's very clear that the convergence point is still a few releases away. It has excellent positioning for where each offering is intended to be used. I'm sure you must have seen it, right?

5 - I have not seen Carl's presentation. Where is it? I just checked sales tools can't see anything in there.

Here is my issue, and bear with me here, customers are being told that Workplace is the future, they are being told to evaluate 1.1, if they get it and then try it, it cannot communicate with their existing Sametime system, it cannot do archiving of conversations, it doesn't have any external APIs, it takes a lot more hardware, has a lot more dependancies, it doesn't work with a Sametime client, it doesn't do the things that make Web Conferencing valuable. Seriously, when someone reads Web Conferncing they do NOT think of sharing a PowerPoint file, PowerPoint does that out of the box already.

If there are no innovations going into Workplace IM/Conferencing then are they going into Sametime? Sametime which I swear by to customers etc. Has been standing relatively still for a couple of years now whilst the competition has been catching up and in some cases overtaking, for example Office Live Server is now a SIP server, Workplace will be a SIP server, so this 5 year lead, that I know you have mentioned in IM, I'm sorry to say has been squandered, now it make come across as I'm the only one saying this to you, but I know for a fact that customers in Lotus's recent WorldWide Customer Council were telling you the same things.

Sadly, I believe the market will reflect on what I have posted here. If IBM wants to prove me wrong then obviously I will be very happy to see it in the form of a hugely successlful product with rapid seat growth, huge transitions from Microsoft Office etc.

If I am wrong in this impression than I am more than happy to hear this from IBM/Lotus customers in this forum or when I meet with them, so far I am not hearing that.

Hopefully, this kind of discussion lights a fire under everyones arse makes them find some passion and wants to address these shortcomings as soon as possible.

So equally cheesed off for different reasons...but the slides do look pretty.

6 - Good points Carl. We have stuck by Notes in out 5000 seat Firm for years, though the last year has been so confusing and the upcoming strategy so fragmented, that the case was made 2 days ago to go exchange.

7 - And what was the response Ed (Fisher)?

8 - It's not as if Carl didn't predict this. If as it seems the Lotus friendlies are confused, just think how customers feel? Current Sametime customers are gonna steer well clear of this. They may also not wait for the off chance for IBM to get it right...and history as we know does not favour 'Big Blue'.

9 - Its interesting what Ed Fisher said, a number of companies I know, have moved from Notes/Domino to Exchange, purely because of the mixed messages that have been coming out of IBM/Lotus.

The message is now clear (hurrah), but I wonder is it too late? many companies seem to need only a little excuse to switch and IBM's strategy has given it to them.

I personally think that many Notes/Domino users will go to exchange rather than Workplace, as the decision was made a while ago before the strategy was made clear.

I am trying to roll out Sametime in my company, and one of our guys said had I looked at the IM workplace component, but having had a brief look, it really is not up to the job, and probably wont be for about 18months... Also the hardware costs were very high, and I thought Workplace (especially messaging) was supposed to be a low cost option..

I also wonder going foreward wether Workplace will make inroads into the SMB area, as it seems just to complicated and expensive. I hope it all works..... but I would not bet my Farm on it...

10 - I'm with you Carl.

Imagine if you went to buy a new model car, and it used 3 times as much petrol, had 1/2 the power and 1/3 of the equipment level of your current car. You might think second thoughts about buying/trading in for one.

11 - What a discussion and I absolutely agree with everything said. For Ed Fisher: If you have something that works why switch ?
Why such a hurry ? You can even stop Passport and continue with your current release for some time.
Unfortunately I know what you are talking about and besides what has been said by others. I do not hope this will become a Deja Vu of the CC:Mail strategy years ago.
Cheers
Heini

12 - I have debated a couple days on posting, just reading and lurking or whatever. But after spending the better part of two days to do fresh installs of Workplace 1.1 I said why not chime in.

Understandably the requirements for hardware alone doubled from 1.0 to 1.1 but that does include the addition of the new components. But splitting out just messaging leaves the per user cost the same but not hardware resources. The documentation for installation, while finely detailed, is terribly fragmented. It jumps and refers to too many outside guides/technical documents and information to be truely useful. You spend more time clicking URL's to the IBM website, following links to other install chapters (nothing worse in Step 2 to read to do this step go read Chapter 8 and then Chapter 8 is short and says go see IBM document at http:...... you get the idea and that is true).

As for IM, it was pretty clear in some reading that the Workplace IM is fresh and new. But it is confusing that it is released so soon if not caught up. If you own the technology (Sametime), why roll out another one that will connect sometime later via SIP? Why not hold that component, integrate Sametime via LDAP and let them merge when it is more mature?

I could go on but I get redundant and someone else can chime in again first.

13 - did you ever get the slides I sent you???